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Claim: Computers to overload global power grid
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LEAF 2 : What we know so far
by geefish (Posted Mon, 25 Jul 2016 19:45:51 GMT+7)
The dailysunknoxville article is rubbish. Carlos Ghosn has twice so far clearly stated clearly that the range extender model Nissan will release is seperate to the Leaf and that the Leaf name will only be associated with BEV's.
Secondly, if you read through some of the articles the dailysunknoxville has released over the years, they are riddled with mistakes and assumptions and are niether based on facts or media releases. They are just a rehash of poor opinions.
Also, Carlos earlier in the year, stated that this December we would see where the next Leaf would be going. Whilst he didnt specify if this would be a reveal of the new model or an actual product release, he was very specific. This is also why I feel a 40kw/h upgrade to the Leaf may be only a rumour - but I've been wrong before and I'm sure I'll be wrong again.
Interesting times ahead.
The dailysunknoxville article is rubbish. Carlos Ghosn has twice so far clearly stated clearly that the range extender model Nissan will release is seperate to the Leaf and that the Leaf name will only be associated with BEV's.
Secondly, if you read through some of the articles the dailysunknoxville has released over the years, they are riddled with mistakes and assumptions and are niether based on facts or media releases. They are just a rehash of poor opinions.
Also, Carlos earlier in the year, stated that this December we would see where the next Leaf would be going. Whilst he didnt specify if this would be a reveal of the new model or an actual product release, he was very specific. This is also why I feel a 40kw/h upgrade to the Leaf may be only a rumour - but I've been wrong before and I'm sure I'll be wrong again.
Interesting times ahead.
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Rumor: Leaf 2017 to get 40kWh
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air conditioner problem
by GerryAZ (Posted Mon, 25 Jul 2016 20:51:40 GMT+7)
Tim,
The early software update that changed the chimes and gave us the "Shift to P Range" dashboard warning with driver door open when not in Park is the one that changed the A/C. The description in the recall notice mentioned changes to the air conditioning system in addition to the other changes, but did not give any detailed information.
Gerry
Tim,
The early software update that changed the chimes and gave us the "Shift to P Range" dashboard warning with driver door open when not in Park is the one that changed the A/C. The description in the recall notice mentioned changes to the air conditioning system in addition to the other changes, but did not give any detailed information.
Gerry
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Will a leaf work for me? Range in pouring rain?
by joem (Posted Mon, 25 Jul 2016 20:54:06 GMT+7)
Thanks everyone! I'll stuff a new timing belt into my 40mpg civic for now and check out what is on the horizon for longer range. I already added a 50A outlet in my garage so I'm prepped and ready when things get a tad more mainstream. Yes the highway I travel is posted 55 but if your going slower than 65 your the slowest person on the road- and it would take me forever to get anywhere. I am amazed that EV's are not more common as all my coworkers could easily make do with a EV and if I lived in town I surly would have at least one!
Take care! see you guys as soon as that larger battery comes out![8-)]( "Cool")
Thanks everyone! I'll stuff a new timing belt into my 40mpg civic for now and check out what is on the horizon for longer range. I already added a 50A outlet in my garage so I'm prepped and ready when things get a tad more mainstream. Yes the highway I travel is posted 55 but if your going slower than 65 your the slowest person on the road- and it would take me forever to get anywhere. I am amazed that EV's are not more common as all my coworkers could easily make do with a EV and if I lived in town I surly would have at least one!
Take care! see you guys as soon as that larger battery comes out
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official 'recall' notice for A/C hose + bracket
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Regenerative braking - why have the option to NOT have this?
by wuyan (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 02:19:31 GMT+7)
Dear OP:
This is my very first post.
I brought LEAF (Chinese version Venucia e30) one year ago.
We don't have the ECO button on the steering wheel instead on the shifter we have "D" and "ECO" mode.
Our "ECO" mode = Your "ECO"+"B"
Our "D" mode = Your "Non ECO"+"D"
And yes the car remember your last choice.
I agree there are drives have no clue what "ECO","None ECO","D","B" means (I personally know people driving this car for month without knowing there is a "ECO" mode).
I personally love your "B" mode, but I hate "ECO" slow down the paddle response make the car feel less agile and nimble(And there is no cruise control option in China).
So I order the steering wheel button assembly from Japan and a cruise control module for Nissan ICE car.
![Image]()
Retrofitting on my car:
![Image]()
It's true for a experienced driver if you turn off or dail down break regen you have more mileage.
Especially on the high way if you drive downhill coasting change POTENTIAL energy to KINETIC (height -> speed) is much more efficient then charging your battery (efficiency < 40%).
According to the LEAF service manual:
Leaf is capable of 80kw of out put and 24kw of break regen.
On the power meter of the instrument panel:
Each dot on the right side(Power Output) represent 8kw of energy (10 dots in total).
Each dot on the left side(Power Regen) represent 6kw of energy (4 dots in total).
![Image]()
YES Nissan also change the logo front and back of rebranded leaf in china.
![Image]()
![Image]()
Which I changed back to the original outlook.
Also Chinese version of leaf have spare tire and rear fog light:
![Image]()
Maybe I'll create a dedicated thread for those who interested in Chinese leaf owner.
And yes there are thousand of us and we are having fun:
![Image]()
dthwaite wrote:I think it would be simpler to always have maximum regenerative braking and just have the "eco" mode to dampen acceleration/limit aircon as it does. With "b mode" you get two levels of regen which is extra superfluous.
I find it tedious always to select "b mode" (its not the default) and I also find it disconcerting that the regen is significantly lessened when the battery is full, so my driving experience is materially altered for no good reason (hey, why's the car not slowing down? oh, battery full).
You can always reduce/control the regen braking effect by keeping your foot lightly on the accelerator. I also think the regen slowing is more similar to engine braking in cylinder cars .
The only reason I can think of having no (or less) regen is perhaps there being some regulatory requirement that lifting your foot of the accelerator pedal should not induce too much braking? Or maybe the brake lights don't go on in max regen mode? But I should think they would go on triggered by the rate of deceleration rather than by what means was used to slow the car.
What do others think?
Dear OP:
This is my very first post.
I brought LEAF (Chinese version Venucia e30) one year ago.
We don't have the ECO button on the steering wheel instead on the shifter we have "D" and "ECO" mode.
Our "ECO" mode = Your "ECO"+"B"
Our "D" mode = Your "Non ECO"+"D"
And yes the car remember your last choice.
I agree there are drives have no clue what "ECO","None ECO","D","B" means (I personally know people driving this car for month without knowing there is a "ECO" mode).
I personally love your "B" mode, but I hate "ECO" slow down the paddle response make the car feel less agile and nimble(And there is no cruise control option in China).
So I order the steering wheel button assembly from Japan and a cruise control module for Nissan ICE car.
Retrofitting on my car:
It's true for a experienced driver if you turn off or dail down break regen you have more mileage.
Especially on the high way if you drive downhill coasting change POTENTIAL energy to KINETIC (height -> speed) is much more efficient then charging your battery (efficiency < 40%).
According to the LEAF service manual:
Leaf is capable of 80kw of out put and 24kw of break regen.
On the power meter of the instrument panel:
Each dot on the right side(Power Output) represent 8kw of energy (10 dots in total).
Each dot on the left side(Power Regen) represent 6kw of energy (4 dots in total).
YES Nissan also change the logo front and back of rebranded leaf in china.
Which I changed back to the original outlook.
Also Chinese version of leaf have spare tire and rear fog light:
Maybe I'll create a dedicated thread for those who interested in Chinese leaf owner.
And yes there are thousand of us and we are having fun:
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Gid Vs SOC and Cell Balance Issue
by GerryAZ (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 04:30:20 GMT+7)
It is normal for Leaf Spy to indicate all cells normal when the battery gets really low (turtle or shutdown). It looks like 24 and 44 are somewhat weak. The other cell pairs listed as weak are not far out of line, but 24 and 44 are likely limiting the allowable depth of discharge. My concern about cell pairs 24 and 44 is that they are consistently the lowest in all of your screen shots with the battery not at full charge. The max/min difference of 297 millivolts is a little high, but not too far out of line for when the battery level gets down to turtle or shutdown. I noticed your tires are at 36 psi--look at the wear patterns. If the edges show more wear than the middle of the tread, you might try increasing the cold pressure to at least 40 psi for improved tire wear, handling, wet stopping distance, and range.
Gerry
It is normal for Leaf Spy to indicate all cells normal when the battery gets really low (turtle or shutdown). It looks like 24 and 44 are somewhat weak. The other cell pairs listed as weak are not far out of line, but 24 and 44 are likely limiting the allowable depth of discharge. My concern about cell pairs 24 and 44 is that they are consistently the lowest in all of your screen shots with the battery not at full charge. The max/min difference of 297 millivolts is a little high, but not too far out of line for when the battery level gets down to turtle or shutdown. I noticed your tires are at 36 psi--look at the wear patterns. If the edges show more wear than the middle of the tread, you might try increasing the cold pressure to at least 40 psi for improved tire wear, handling, wet stopping distance, and range.
Gerry
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Reverse Engineer the Leaf and making it work good (tm)
by NocturnalWalt (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 05:07:02 GMT+7)
Sorry I don't have a firmware update log, but I have observed how the security check works that collink referred to on at least one of the control modules on the Leaf. To be allowed to access protected functions, first the diagnostic tool must pass a test that the ECU gives it. To start the test the ECU sends a pseudo-random number. Based on that number and a 'secret' algorithm, the diagnostics tool generates a 64-bit key which must be correct before access is granted. Apparently other vehicles in the early 2000s used a similar security system but with a 32-bit key which could be cracked by brute force. But with a 64-bit key brute force isn't an option. Also, because the ECU generates a different pseudo-random number each time, a single log of a firmware update wouldn't help with getting past the security - but it still would be very interesting to see. So it isn't exactly going to be easy, but all is not lost.
Also, I'm pretty confident that the Leaf isn't UDS compliant, although many of the commands are shared with UDS.
caederus wrote:It would be very helpful to have a candump log of a dealer doing a firmware upgrade - does anyone already have one they'd be willing to share, or a way to obtain one?
Sorry I don't have a firmware update log, but I have observed how the security check works that collink referred to on at least one of the control modules on the Leaf. To be allowed to access protected functions, first the diagnostic tool must pass a test that the ECU gives it. To start the test the ECU sends a pseudo-random number. Based on that number and a 'secret' algorithm, the diagnostics tool generates a 64-bit key which must be correct before access is granted. Apparently other vehicles in the early 2000s used a similar security system but with a 32-bit key which could be cracked by brute force. But with a 64-bit key brute force isn't an option. Also, because the ECU generates a different pseudo-random number each time, a single log of a firmware update wouldn't help with getting past the security - but it still would be very interesting to see. So it isn't exactly going to be easy, but all is not lost.
Also, I'm pretty confident that the Leaf isn't UDS compliant, although many of the commands are shared with UDS.
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Charging Timer End Time Only
by GerryAZ (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 05:43:13 GMT+7)
Did you inadvertently have a start time programmed? If you previously used the timers, there may have been a start time still in program memory. In that case, charging would not start until the start time was reached. Another possibility--did you have the correct day(s) selected for Timer A before closing the timer screen?
Gerry
JTim wrote:EVinCbus wrote:I'm having an issue with the charging timer when set only for an end time. The manual states that if a start time is NOT set, but an end time is, the car will determine when to start charging to reach the desired charge at the set end time.
I think I've just had the first part of this problem today:
Model: 2016 SV 30 kHw
I wanted to set the timer as an end-point only, so that the car would automatically begin charging, as according to the manual.
I used the blue Nissan logo, checked the Estimated Time, then edited the schedule. At that time it was July 25, 2016, 8pm-ish. I wanted the timer to stop at 8:30 am the next day when I would leave so I set the end timer under Edit Schedule for July 26, 2016, 8:30am. I thought this meant that the car would automatically start sometime during the night and end at 8:30am.
I set Timer A for 8:30 am as an end timer, and saved my work. I turned my car off as instructed and plugged in. The three lights blinked in sequence and then turned dark after five minutes just as the manual notes.
But when I checked in the morning, no charging had been performed.
What did I miss?
J.Tim
Did you inadvertently have a start time programmed? If you previously used the timers, there may have been a start time still in program memory. In that case, charging would not start until the start time was reached. Another possibility--did you have the correct day(s) selected for Timer A before closing the timer screen?
Gerry
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EVSE Upgrade CABLE FOR TRADE ONLY -'15 NISSAN LEAF
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P3180 on battery
by keydiver (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 06:27:24 GMT+7)
You are getting a P3180 code, with no other error codes? If so, I would assume that it was just a charging glitch. Reset the DTC's with LeafSpy and I bet it won't come back.
You are getting a P3180 code, with no other error codes? If so, I would assume that it was just a charging glitch. Reset the DTC's with LeafSpy and I bet it won't come back.
VCM detects an error signal that is received from LBC via CAN
communication for 0.02 seconds or more.
NOTE: This DTC is detected when LBC detects DTC. If this DTC detected, perform trouble diagnosis for a DTC that
detected by LBC.
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How long 'til 4th bar drops?
by Stanton (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 06:44:04 GMT+7)
I have no doubt you will make it with summer in full swing. The excessive QC's may actually be delaying the 4th bar drop. Sounds like you're driving it hard enough. Doesn't matter how long it takes to get to 100% charge so long as it bakes in the heat overnight.
BradFoxUS wrote:Almost every weekend I do probably 4 or 5 QC sessions each day of Saturday and Sunday. Each day putting me at 10 temp bars and very reduced acceleration until the next morning. Our daily highs have been High 90's to low 100's. Evenings looking to be about 80F. I bought my Leaf second hand from a dealer who had no knowledge of the car. Leaf Spy was extremely handy during the "Sales Dance".
I have no doubt you will make it with summer in full swing. The excessive QC's may actually be delaying the 4th bar drop. Sounds like you're driving it hard enough. Doesn't matter how long it takes to get to 100% charge so long as it bakes in the heat overnight.
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P3180 on battery
by jmk (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 07:38:14 GMT+7)
Yes no other codes whatsoever. I did cell balancing after which all voltages are near perfect (currently 3.753 / 3.759 / 3.765), removed the 12V battery for a while and reset the DTC. At least the code cleared, let's hope it does not come back![:-)]( "Smile")
When that happened it was connected to cheap EBUSBAR charger so maybe that has something...
keydiver wrote:You are getting a P3180 code, with no other error codes? If so, I would assume that it was just a charging glitch. Reset the DTC's with LeafSpy and I bet it won't come back.
Yes no other codes whatsoever. I did cell balancing after which all voltages are near perfect (currently 3.753 / 3.759 / 3.765), removed the 12V battery for a while and reset the DTC. At least the code cleared, let's hope it does not come back
When that happened it was connected to cheap EBUSBAR charger so maybe that has something...
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Reverse Engineer the Leaf and making it work good (tm)
by nickandre (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 08:26:16 GMT+7)
Yeah that smells like RSA/asymmetric cryptography which will be difficult to crack unless you're the NSA. Easiest way to do that would not be sniffing but instead disassembly of code on the programmer itself to find the key, which perhaps is easier than hardware extracting the code off the ECU.
Anyone know if the firmware upgrade uses the Consult tool?
Yeah that smells like RSA/asymmetric cryptography which will be difficult to crack unless you're the NSA. Easiest way to do that would not be sniffing but instead disassembly of code on the programmer itself to find the key, which perhaps is easier than hardware extracting the code off the ECU.
Anyone know if the firmware upgrade uses the Consult tool?
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L2 stopped working on 2 cars. EVSE or cars? What to do?
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Will a leaf work for me? Range in pouring rain?
by Nubo (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 10:00:33 GMT+7)
Are you taking US 26? That looks like a 55mph road.
joem wrote:I want to buy a leaf but I'm worried that I'm just outside its range. My commute is 80 miles rt @ 70MPH from zip code 97049 to 97216 for a visual on google. Elevation change of 1,000' via 2 4% hills and wintertime conditions almost always with temperatures in the 40F range and pouring rain- does the leaf kick in the AC pump when the defrosters are turned on? I would simply blow cold air on the window to de-fog. I also have no chance of charging at workMost leaf owners tell me zero chance of making it home but I want to check in here before looking at a plug in hybrid.
Thanks guys! Joe
Most leaf owners tell me zero chance of making it home but I want to check in here before looking at a plug in hybrid.Are you taking US 26? That looks like a 55mph road.
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Nissan Leaf EVSE upgrade - Reviews? Reliable?
by HomerjEV (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 10:59:48 GMT+7)
For Canadian shoppers I thought I would mention the EV Duty line of made in Canada EVSEs.
I just purchased a 2016 Leaf and agonized over which EVSE to buy. After a great deal of research I opted to buy an EV Duty EVC30T made by Elmec. At C$729 (C$739 with NEMA 6-50 plug) it was well priced. It is a basic 30 Amp unit and very solid. The plug in version that I purchased is sold as portable and truly is. The wall mount allows for easy removal and a lock mount gives it some measure of security while mounted. It includes a 25 foot charging cord. The unit is very sturdy and rugged feeling. I expect it to last forever.
These EVSEs are made in Quebec and ship free. Mine shipped the same day and arrived in less than a week. The fact that they only charge an extra $10 for the plug in model versus the hard wired model made me warm and fuzzy about the company and made me think they weren`t trying to gouge me. The warranty is 3 years. I live in Vancouver so temperature extremes are not an issue but the unit is designed to work in very cold Canadian winter conditions. The cords are made from a material that is flexible in very cold temperatures.
I have written this post because many EVSE round ups miss this line of EVSEs and they are first rate and well priced. I love mine.
For Canadian shoppers I thought I would mention the EV Duty line of made in Canada EVSEs.
I just purchased a 2016 Leaf and agonized over which EVSE to buy. After a great deal of research I opted to buy an EV Duty EVC30T made by Elmec. At C$729 (C$739 with NEMA 6-50 plug) it was well priced. It is a basic 30 Amp unit and very solid. The plug in version that I purchased is sold as portable and truly is. The wall mount allows for easy removal and a lock mount gives it some measure of security while mounted. It includes a 25 foot charging cord. The unit is very sturdy and rugged feeling. I expect it to last forever.
These EVSEs are made in Quebec and ship free. Mine shipped the same day and arrived in less than a week. The fact that they only charge an extra $10 for the plug in model versus the hard wired model made me warm and fuzzy about the company and made me think they weren`t trying to gouge me. The warranty is 3 years. I live in Vancouver so temperature extremes are not an issue but the unit is designed to work in very cold Canadian winter conditions. The cords are made from a material that is flexible in very cold temperatures.
I have written this post because many EVSE round ups miss this line of EVSEs and they are first rate and well priced. I love mine.
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The Battery Replacement Thread
by Stanton (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 11:47:34 GMT+7)
I believe this will happen...down the road...in 2-3 years time...and would probably include even larger capacities. Having received a warranty (free) pack replacement, I can actually envision buying one more pack for my Leaf (when this one eventually degrades) if it was significantly larger (like 40+ kWh). The rest of the car seems to be rock-solid.
edatoakrun wrote:So, Nissan might find that it is in their best interest to offer ~24 kWh to ~30 kWh pack upgrades to LEAF owners in the USA, in the future.
I believe this will happen...down the road...in 2-3 years time...and would probably include even larger capacities. Having received a warranty (free) pack replacement, I can actually envision buying one more pack for my Leaf (when this one eventually degrades) if it was significantly larger (like 40+ kWh). The rest of the car seems to be rock-solid.
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2016 models in NC
by nickandre (Posted Tue, 26 Jul 2016 13:13:18 GMT+7)
I got my 2013 SV in southern MA for $12,700 last October with ~16k miles with QC and LED lights. It was at 12 bars at the time, but dropped to 11 shortly thereafter, holding steady at 82-85% since then (we'll see how the summer does for it). Had been leased in Georgia, so I surmise the heat had an impact and that the driver probably never bothered with the "Long Life Mode."
Just know that most used car dealerships have NO CLUE what an EV is. One guy we visited spent about 25 minutes telling us that the "first EV was the Prius and he didn't like the Prius as much as the Leaf."
Maintenance for me has been just tires and a recall reprogramming (plus I lost a key down a storm drain -- don't do that, they scam you out of $300).
Snow performance is pretty abysmal but it does have a handy light to tell you that it's slipping sideways and it's very good at doing donuts in an abandoned parking lot in the snow if you disable traction control.
It _looks_ like many of the 2013s that came off lease have probably been sold already. There seem to be a lot in the area right now judging by Craigslist, but mostly 2012 and 2015. Prices continue to fall like stones out of a crumbling soviet union (my car is down $3k for 10k miles over 11 months, wondering when it will near golf cart prices).
I got my 2013 SV in southern MA for $12,700 last October with ~16k miles with QC and LED lights. It was at 12 bars at the time, but dropped to 11 shortly thereafter, holding steady at 82-85% since then (we'll see how the summer does for it). Had been leased in Georgia, so I surmise the heat had an impact and that the driver probably never bothered with the "Long Life Mode."
Just know that most used car dealerships have NO CLUE what an EV is. One guy we visited spent about 25 minutes telling us that the "first EV was the Prius and he didn't like the Prius as much as the Leaf."
Maintenance for me has been just tires and a recall reprogramming (plus I lost a key down a storm drain -- don't do that, they scam you out of $300).
Snow performance is pretty abysmal but it does have a handy light to tell you that it's slipping sideways and it's very good at doing donuts in an abandoned parking lot in the snow if you disable traction control.
It _looks_ like many of the 2013s that came off lease have probably been sold already. There seem to be a lot in the area right now judging by Craigslist, but mostly 2012 and 2015. Prices continue to fall like stones out of a crumbling soviet union (my car is down $3k for 10k miles over 11 months, wondering when it will near golf cart prices).
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